Hi All

I am working for a company that works with wifi sharing.

We have purchased 3 samples routers from a Chinese company that is suppose to be able to run OpenWRT, we found that is was true with a twist. They run Pandora and can only use packages from openwrt.org.cn. And it don't seems like we can build our won version with source from openwrt.org, which we need to be able to do.

We found the router company on alibaba.com and I am wondering if any of you have had experience with this issue. Can you find routers on alibaba that supports real openwrt. Have you order routers from a good company that works in a good way with openwrt and what did you pay?

What device, what vendor?

Why do you think you can't build your own version?

What cpu (cat /proc/cpuinfo)?

How much ram and flash? ("df", "cat /proc/meminfo")

Can you telnet in or ssh in to get to a command line?  If so, what version of openWrt is it running ("r#####" number). 

Can you download a version of openWrt AA for your cpu and flash it with sysupgrade?

TP-Link WL703N, WR841N among others will run openWrt and are available on aliexpress.

What do you want to do with your router?

(Last edited by lizby on 5 May 2014, 00:10)

Pandora maintainer super lintel does some hacks in UBoot,so it's not easy for you to make a firmware.However,the dev trac will help .
https://dev.openwrt.org.cn/

I assume you choose hg255d? a rather cheap one with 300M wireless?

The one I got uses the MT7620n and I read in this thread
https://forum.openwrt.org/viewtopic.php?id=49938

that is seems impossible to build our own version.

I have a startup that is providing routers for small business with wifi sharing capability, here it is important that we can build our own version and get the manufacturer to put our image on the device before shipment.

As a startup we know a lot about programming but in specific areas, we don't have so much knowledge regarding building the linux kernel and specific not regarding router and openWRT, so we are a bit lost regarding this.

openwrt.org.cn has nothing to do with openwrt.org: this is just a "fan" site frm China that tries to mimic how OpenWrt is working, with a twist: as most people in China, they don't care about intellectual properties the same way as in Occidental countries...

Thus, in the OpenWrt-based sources you have there, you will find copyrighted Meditaek/Ralink sources and big binary blobs, which are obviously not the way OpenWrt is supposed to work.

In particular, the MT7620 is supported in the official OpenWrt, but not WiFi yet... Which turns it into an almost useless router SoC at the moment.

I suggest you read the Wiki (http://wiki.openwrt.org/toh/start)  to find an OpenWrt-supported device list or at least CPU, then go shopping with some technical requirements, like CPU, Flash/RAM capacities, number of wired Ethernet and USB ports, serial console, RF parameters like single/dual band, antenna type, etc..

But don't forget to ask about CE/FCC/IC/RoHS certification (and proof of it!) if you must be able to resell these products in your country! They will often advertise it, but when asked, it is always "yes, we can do it!", meaning that it isn't done yet, and that they are waiting for a big order to finance it...

Another common trick you must be aware of is to have routers that are not individually RF-calibrated: you must know that given the wide RF spectrum required by WiFi, it is not possible to guarantee a compliant frequency response over the whole frequency range without individually calibrating each board on the production line and storing the calibration information into a router's partition for use by the WiFi driver. Of course, cheap manufacturers won't tell you about this or ven lie, but this can be found out by comparing the calibration partition among several devices for a match: there should be at least some differences other than the MAC address!

I hope the above information will be helpful!

From many years of experience i do like to give some advice :

You plan to sell knowledge in form of services bundled with hardware, so your decision is where to put your effords i.e.money ( development / hardware / programming )

Believe me, the cost of hardware is minimal compared to the total cost.
IMHO to select 'cheap' hardware would cost you too much in time/efford/money.

As you stated you do not have much knowledge in building router-OS (OWRT), you really should find some freelancer to get you on a steep learning curve fast.

Do not underestimate the complexity of professional approach of your product.

I wish you good luck

regards
3zl

Very helpful post, that was what i figured when reading the post I linked to. Yesterday I talked with another manufacture regarding a router I posted some requirements:

CPU: the platform must support standard OpenWRT (openwrt.org) no Pandora or other versions.
For instance Atheros AR9331 or Ralink RT5350 series.

FLASH: minimum 8M
SDRAM: minimum 32M
300 mbps
1 x WAN port

I got this back:
CPU    MTK7620 580MHz
Flash    8MB
RAM    32MB
Ethernet port    1WAN 4LAN, 10/100M
Serial port    Can solder one serial port on sample units
Wireless 802.11n    Yes
Software    Basic OpenWRT with Bootloader, CLI
Product box (pakcing)    UTT Standard box

Do any of you know the MTK7620 and what else beside the certification to ask for?

Thanks, I have though about the freelancer thing and I wondering if that is a good approach. My question is where to find them I was thinking if I should post something here in the forum searching for a freelancer to help me get started.

You can PM me and I can help you both with Openwrt and contacts in China.

This the MediaTeK 7620 I was talking about above in my post: no WiFi support in vanilla OpenWrt, either AA or BB trunk yet, so pretty useless at the moment.

You need to ask for QA (Quality Assurance) documents regarding the RF calibration, i.e. to get a proof that individual RF calibration has been performed if you do not trust your partner. This can be an exhaustive file for all your routers, or an on-demand for samples. But they won't do that for low quantities...

300 mbps is a pretty restrictive requirement, do you really need it?

Both AR9331 and RT5350 SoC only feature 150 mbps RF, so they won't match. You can get an external RF chip of course...

The MT(K)7620 is 300 mbps, but not supported yet by stock OpenWrt.

You are right I change it to 150mbps.

Hi Squonk

Sorry to ask you so much, hope it is ok.

I am writing some new manufactures regarding buying some samples. I have written this to them, I want to ensure that they do it right this time.

What do you think is it clear enough and are things missing? I am not completely sure I use the right terms and explanations.

--------------

We are looking for a router where we can put our own openwrt build on. So it i important that we can build our version from openwrt.org source directly. To ensure all intellectual properties rights is supported. So the source for a openwrt build must not come from openwrt.org.cn.

The router must be installed with openwrt from the beginning. The version must be supplied to us as a binary and you must supply us with instructions for the build process that resulted in that binary. Further more we need to .config file for the build process and hardware descriptions for all hardware within the router.

All of the above must be supplied before any order samples or production routers will be ordered.

Minimum spec requirements for the router:
---------
- CPU: the platform must support standard OpenWRT (openwrt.org) no source must be included from openwrt.org.cn.
- Could be Atheros AR9331 or Ralink RT5350 series or others.

- FLASH: minimum 8M
- SDRAM: minimum 32M
- 150 mbps
- min. 1 x WAN port
- Wireless 802.11n
- Dual band

Other requirements
----------
- Every router must be individually RF-calibrated
- Every router have a global unique mac address
- Opportunity to have logo on router and product box. 
- CE/FCC/IC/RoHS certification must be proved by scanning it and sending it by email.

all will be good except dual band

I have removed dual band, so that is great.

The best feedback i got so far is this:
http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/8 … 37426.html

it uses the Ralink 3052, what do you guys think?

I am not very familiar with building my own linux kernel, so I figured that if I can get the .config file this can help me big time when I need to build my own, and perhaps I can figure out if it can be build with standard openwrt.

Would that be an approach, what would you guys do. I can see that when a new router comes along you post a message in this forum and you dive in, helping with building openwrt for the router. How do you figure out what modules and packages you need for the router, do you get some kind of log form the device so you can figure it out or?

Again, sorry I am very newbie to routers and openwrt.

Utah, I am in China these days. I will be flying out next week.  China is nothing like the US. Its not like you can go on to the internet and find exactly what you are looking for.  Things change in China on the fly. The specification, the price, the delivery, nothing is constant, or exactly as advertised most of the time. I have a company in China and one in the US. I have Chinese staff who help me do the digging. If you are interested in getting some thing which will work good for you, feel free to contact me before I fly out. I will return to China, but that would be after one month.

(Last edited by ron on 6 May 2014, 17:17)

That model linked to in post 15 +looks+ like this dx.com device:

http://www.dx.com/s/WR3G01

I have that, and it (my version) definitely runs openWrt.  My version is labeled R7205, not R7203, and it has 4mb flash, not 8mb.  Unfortunately, it does not show any certifications.

Thanks for the post, have you put openwrt on it ourself or did it come with it?

I installed it myself: ATTITUDE ADJUSTMENT (12.09, r36088)

I don't remember specifically, but this was probably downloaded, not custom-built.  I also don't remember whether I was able to flash through the web page or had to do tftp over ethernet from uboot using the serial console.  The pins for the console were pre-installed on my device--I just opened it up and added a cable.

ok great.

I would presume that I would be able to build our own version for the router then, great thanks.

>I would presume that I would be able to build our own version for the router then

Yes, certainly.  I see on alibaba that versions with 8M flash and 16M flash are available (quantity 100).

Someone, I believe Squonk, posted that wireless throughput with the Ralink routers is substantially less than for the AR71xx.  That hasn't mattered for my use--as a wifi client in my barn reading temperature sensors and controlling a heater through usb/serial to a picaxe microprocessor.

If you are looking for mt7620 sources, you can download it from github
https://github.com/qdk0901/openwrt-mt7620

This version supposedly included the WIFI drivers required and should work.
This is probably a clone of the openwrt.cn repository though.
As far as I am aware of, the official openwrt.cn repository no longer have the mt7620 wifi drivers.

IMO, unless you are going to buy thousands or more of these things, you are probably better off buying off the shelf, branded products and change its ROM to yours. Similar as what gargoyle-router.com sells in their store.

No, I said that the AR9331 RF is more efficient in terms of power consumption than the RT5350F: 0.5 W vs. 1.4 W @ 18 dBm.

In the same RF conditions, having decent hardware with calibrated RF and with the same antenna, I haven't seen a substantial difference in throughput, though.

You can even get just the WiFi patch for MT7620 to apply on latest trunk:
https://github.com/wuqiong/rt2860v2-for-openwrt-mt7620

But be aware that in many countries, unauthorized use of copyrighted material is prohibited.

For example, read the header of https://github.com/qdk0901/openwrt-mt76 … v2/ap/ap.c